THE MORMON CURTAIN
Containing 5,709 Articles Spanning 365 Topics
Ex-Mormon News, Stories And Recovery
Archives From 2005 thru 2014
If you have reached this page from an outside source such as an
Internet Search or forum referral, please note that this page
(the one you just landed on)
is an archive containing articles on
"MISSIONARIES - SECTION 1".
The Mormon Curtain
- is a website that blogs the Ex-Mormon world. You can
The Mormon Curtain FAQ
to understand the purpose of this website.
CLICK HERE to visit the main page of The Mormon Curtain.
MISSIONARIES - SECTION 1
Topics concerning Mormon Missionaries - from young to old.
| Mormon men at the age of 19 are commanded to serve a 2-year mission. It is not an option, it is expected. Those who do not serve missions risk being ostracized by their families and church members. If they do not go they will be seen as willfull and disobediant. Those who go and come back early are looked on as sinners. Some families with early returned missionaries go as far as moving or even disowning their own sons.
Mormons who receive their mission calls believe the calls to be done by direct revelation from God, however, there is a department in the LDS Church Office Building where thousands of mission calls are done per day.
Missionaries spend up to three months (for foreign language missions) at the Missionary Training Program in Provo, Utah. Here they are under lock and key and guards patrol the grounds. High fences keep missionaries inside where they are indoctrinated in the Mormon gospel. All privileges are taken away and they are not even allowed to have contact with their own families. They are told they are now "Elders" and they are punished if they use their first names. Anything not LDS is contraband and taken away.
Missionaries serving in countries requiring passports - Mission Presidents illegally confiscate passports making it nearly impossible for missionaries to leave the country. They are not allowed to call their family, not allowed to have any social media, cell phones or Internet.
"At any given moment more than 60,000 Mormon missionaries are roaming the globe, closely supervised by church leaders back in Utah, intent on converting the world to Mormonism. These missionaries and their supporters aggressively assert that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is mankind's "One True Church," and that all other religions are false." - Jon Krakauer, "Under The Banner Of Heaven".
Missions are not to bring in new converts to the Mormon Church, Missions are to de-program the missionary and set them up to be lifetime paying members.
Missions for the Mormon Church serve to take a young man out of his element and deprive him of his family, friends and familiarity - all the while cramming his entire day full of rigorous priorities centered around obedience to the Cult.
In October of 2012, the age of boys was changed to 18, and 19 for girls.
| From KLAS-TV Las Vegas:
Oct. 7) -- Five months ago Metro Police arrested a missionary with the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. He was
accused of molesting two girls at a Las Vegas church.
Prosecutors told Eyewitness News Tuesday they have now filed charges in that case.
Mormon missionary John Misseldine is accused of molesting two girls during service back on May 4, 2003. The two young girls, ages
4 and 7, say they were fondled by Misseldine while he was watching them in a room at an LDS chapel.
According to police reports, this happened while the seven-year-old girl's mother was in service. The girl says she sat on
Misseldine's lap and he put his hand up her dress she was wearing and put his hand inside her panties. A doctor who examined the
girl found proof of penetration. The four-year-old claims Misseldine rubbed her on top of her clothes.
Misseldine is now charged with one count of sexual assault with a minor under 14. And two counts of lewdness with a child under
14. But it took prosecutors 5 months after they initially arrested the 21-year-old Mormon missionary to file charges.
District Attorney David Roger says it has taken this long because police thoroughly investigated all of the allegations. "It's
important for us to have all of our i's dotted and t's crossed in cases so when we file cases we can prove beyond a reasonable
doubt and we're ready to go trial the day we file the charges," he stated.
Misseldine was released from jail on May 5 on $10 thousand bail and faces life in prison if convicted.
D.A. Roger continues, "If the judge were to run them consecutive it would be 2 life sentences and would have to serve a minimum
of 30 years before he's eligable for parole.
The LDS church declined to speak with Eyewitness News on camera Tuesday. Back in May, they were conducting an internal
investigation. But the results would not be made public.
Misseldine will be arraigned in justice court on Oct. 29.
| My minor daughter received a phone-call from Church headquarters alerting her that her name had been reported to them as someone in need of spiritual help. They wanted to set up an appointment for the missionaries to deliver a free videotape gift to her.
She was very upset by this. She refused an appointment but as a 16-yr-old was unsuccessful in getting herself out of their cross-hairs. The Mormons still perceived an opening if they could just get into our home.
Later in the week one of the missionaries assigned to my area phoned to set up the appointment. I intercepted the call and while distressed gave a convincing explanation of why no one in my family is interested in joining the LDS Church.
I heard nothing for a few weeks and thought the ordeal had passed. But then Church headquarters called my daughter again about her request for missionary visitation. She was upset again and told the caller repeatedly that she had never said that.
A few months passed. I thought it was over until last night when new missionaries showed up on my doorstep. They asked for my daughter by name. Instead they got to stand in the cold and visit with my husband and myself through our screen door.
They were handsome and bright young men from Brazil and Maryland where they had grown up in the Mormon minority. Imagine then being sent into a 99% Mormon community to proselytize. We told them what a wild cultural experience living here as part of the teeny non-Mormon minority is.
We told them that our experience is very isolating. How the topic of our non-Mormonism is consistently brought up by members of the community. We keep to ourselves mostly because when we try to interact socially our non-belonging is made an issue again and again. It is distressing to constantly be reminded of one's outcast state.
I cannot think of one time in nearly twenty years where I was the one to bring up the subject of religion. But near strangers never seem to hesitate to ask: "Do you know brother so-and-so? Well aren't you and he in the same ward? Well what ward are you in?" Then comes the awkward silence after which the new acquaintance loses interest in my friendship. I then am disregarded or become a target. I cannot count the times that has happened.
The missionaries thought my husband and I looked like nice respectable people and said so. They asked us what we thought about Joseph Smith. Did we believe he was a prophet? We both said we do not and talked for a few minutes with the young men about founding fathers of their church and false prophecies, blood atonement verses blood of Christ, and subjective verses objective evaluation of historical facts.
It's not as if we have never heard of their good news. I don't know if they really got just how deeply we do understand Mormonism, how we have lived heavily under the influence of the Church for much longer than the combined ages of these young missionaries. Leaving the Mormonism has not been something we have taken lightly or done without great difficulty. Why would we endure being shunned as apostates if everything about this religion is as rosy as these young men have been led to believe?
One missionary, apparently the senior companion, admitted to having an uncle who is a former high priest and very recent ex-Mormon. He stated that anti-Mormon materials, such as those which led his uncle away from the Church, have been twisted from their original source and meaning, and that no question has ever come up which he as a missionary cannot answer.
But now, he said, If I am open to learning and am willing to do four things (read Book of Mormon, pray, fast, and one other thing which I do not recall at the moment) I will receive the spiritual confirmation of the truth. He boldly promised me that.
My husband and I just looked at each other and shook our heads. I invited the missionaries to read my review of the Book of Mormon on amazon.com. It is not "anti-material" at all, I told them, only my testimony of the years-long struggle I went through in my sincere attempts to receive that promised spiritual witness. I was informed that the missionaries are not allowed on the Internet.
In the end I stated that I could be vulnerable to the temptation to put my thinking self aside and fold under intense peer pressure. I am a woman who values relationships. But wouldn't anyone of either gender want to be respected? I am vulnerable only because I would like to be accepted by my estranged extended family and the community in which I live.
I told the missionaries that while I value family and community relationships, my personal integrity is also a deeply held value. I said that I regret having been forced into the position of having to choose between these values, but that if I have to choose between relationships and my own integrity, well I've already chosen as you can see.
I was then told that the offer was always on the table if I ever want to take it up. By then these guys were freezing, because while I quite liked them I do not welcome what they are doing and so they were never asked inside. They failed to receive that hoped for access to our daughter. And the poor local high school kid that was with them was not dressed for the weather. I told him sorry it's so cold out there, thanked the missionaries, and we all said goodnight.
Thanks for taking time to read my lengthy post. You're welcome to also see my Book of Mormon review at amazon.com
| I never really believed that priesthood blessings were legit, and I always felt a little uneasy when I was in a coercive
situation where I felt constrained to give one. Those who held the Melchizedek priesthood here will know what I mean -- like when
Sister Hypochondria calls you up and asks for a blessing of health because she has gas. When listening to others give priesthood
blessings, they always seemed to use the same phrases, as if they had their own mental template for what it was they were going
to say when they gave blessings.
I heard of strange priesthood blessings, and I was involved in one very uncomfortable one during my mission. One story involved
two missionaries in Nevada. The Elder who was driving the car hit a jack rabbit (a common thing in and around the Mojave Desert).
He got out of the car, saw the rabbit lying motionless, with blood oozing out of its mouth, and then proceeded to squat down, lay
his hands on the rabbit, and give it a priesthood blessing, commanding it to come back to life. After several minutes of this,
the missionary finally gave up.
One time, while knocking doors in Italy, we happened upon a large home with a large family. My companion was an Idahoan who was a
little on the wacky side. One family member let us in, and we saw a bed-ridden man in the other room. We chatted with him for a
minute, at which point my companion said, ``If you have faith to be healed, we have the power to heal you.'' The man's eyes lit
up, and he said he wanted a blessing. I tried hard to have faith (I was extreme TBM during my mission). We laid our hands on his
head and my companion went into a really long blessing. During the blessing, various familiy members came home, looked into the
room to see two Mormon missionaries with their hands on their family member's head, and they wondered what the hell we were
doing. I felt very uncomfortable with the whole situation. My companion called him up a few days later to ask how he was doing.
He said he felt a little better the next day, and then got a lot sicker the day after that.
I was tracting with this same companion (which mainly involves buzzing intercom buttons on apartment complexes and asking people
to listen to us). Once, we buzzed an apartment, and the man politely, yet firmly, told us that he was not interested in listening
to us. As we walked away, my companion stopped, hesitated, and said to me, ``Elder, I feel inspired to ask that man again if he
wants to listen to us. I think he really needs help.'' He proceeded to march back up to the intercom and buzz the man again. My
companion started asking if everything was alright and if he needed anything. The man got quite irate at that point and told us
to go away, which my companion reluctantly did at that point.
Once, when I came into a city as a Zone Leader, I found that my new companion had been teaching a mentally challenged man for
some time. He was very slow, and seemed unsure of himself, and he seemed extremely impressionable. I would have nothing to do
with the discussions, and I would frequently challenge my companion, asking if he was sure that this man was accountable and was
capable of making good decisions. My companion assured me that he was (this may have had something to do with the fact that he
was the only person in our teaching pool, and having someone in your teaching pool makes your numbers look better). The
discussions would go something like this:
Missionary: "Marco, do you believe in God?"
Missoinary: "So you understand that God wants you to be baptized, right?"
Marco: "I guess. I don't really know."
Missionary: "I know that God wants you to be baptized, Marco."
(Marco stares at the floor for a long time)
Missionary: "Will you be baptized, Marco?"
One day, after having left the apartment, a neighbor lady started chewing us out, asking us why we were harassing that poor
handicapped man. She insisted that he was not all there, and he could not make good decisions on his own, and we were taking
advantage of him. I knew she was right, and I just wanted to crawl under a rock, but my companion just stood there with a shocked
and confused look on his face, trying to convince her that this man really was competant. After all, the Spirit had told him that
Marco was accountable. The neighbor lady must have contacted his relatives, because one day, when we went to visit, Marco had all
of the materials the missionaries had given to him in a pile, and when he answered the door, he just looked at the ground,
holding the packet out, repeating, ``I can't. I can't. I'm sorry. I can't.'' My companion went through the whole ``I'm thoroughly
devastated at your terrible decision'' splurge, and then reluctantly went away.
Okay, enough stories for now.
| Just got back from wintering in PR. We saw the missies on the street and invited them over to our place for a little american fellowship. There were 4 of them and they spent a lot of time with us. In the 3 months we were there they did not baptise or come close to baptising anyone. They had 2 open houses that nobody came to. They told us about 70% of the people that have been baptised dont last and the ones that do stay seem to do it their own way. Thay had a big meeting in San Juan with a gen authority in attendance (Damn my old brain ,I cant think of his name) any way they said he came to PR to address the poor results. They said the missionary only meeting was good but the gen. meeting was poorly attended.The Gen authorities know the church is falling on its ass in PR and they still continue to send those kids there to waste 2 years of their lives, not too mention the money. The zone leaders have cars but the rest are supposed to ride bikes,however they rarely rode the bikes because the roads are too narrow and the drivers too crazy, it was just too dangerous to ride,so most of the time they walked and were unable to cover too much ground that way.Many nites they wound up at our place and I would drive them the 6 miles to theit apt. Thats right they walked 6 miles to get to us , didnt leave them too much time to meet any body new on the way. Just thought I'd let you know the church is 1/2 dead and dieing in PR as I would guess it is doing in many other places.
| My son was preparing for a mission a few years ago, but quickly changed his mind after a good friend returned with horror stories of the MTC. His friend told him that once they got you in there, there was no way out. The friend needed to have dental work done. (the MTC was not satisfied that his personal dentist did NOT require his wisdom teeth to be removed) MTC forced him to have the teeth removed by their dentist at the MTC and would not allow him to leave the MTC to have it done! This kid thought that his life would get better, but it only became worse with all the morg regulations and poor companions. He said it was NOT the best two years of his life. He was miserable and wanted to come home but knew that would mean a dishonorable mission.
This young man went on to say what a jerk the mission president was when he became ill. He was so ill that they thought he might be sent home. But his TBM mother made him stay and told him not to come home because of what the ward members might think. There were many more tales of woe from
I always felt bad for the young men who were so sweet before going into this and then coming out with a whole different personality. I'm sure that alot of young men have had great experiences. But what about the poor guys who were miserable and sacrificed the best two years of their life to the morg? I'm sure there are many of them!
Again, it's the Mormon way. Brainwash them to serve a mission or get endowments and just like the majority of us, they have no clue of what they are getting themselves into.
HOW VERY SAD!
| I went in on August 20th 1991, a week after my 19th birthday. I was scared as hell, yet trying to get excited since I was being sent to Venezuela. What a awesome experience I thought.
My MTC companion was really weird. A bible thumper and was so straight laced it was difficult. I had a few friends in the district and we played ULTIMATE each PDAY.
I had a hard time learning the language and felt the structure was overwhelming to say the least. It was difficult to adapt for 2 weeks.
I faked sick a few times so I could sleep in and use the bathroom with noone around. That was heaven. I really thought the MTC was a prison. THe Gustapo drove around in their grey mission vans everynite.
My girlfriend delivered a pizza to me over the fence one night and we rushed it in under our sweatshirts and ate it up hiding the evidence. The next day, one of the MTC teachers was trying to find out who had smuggled in a pizza and was going to reprimand them for not following rules.
The place was a prison. The fence was not yet erected and playing Ultimate was the only relief. Noone talks about the fist fights among elders on the Ultimate field, but I got into a few of them.
We couldn't go to the mall without permission from the Branch president and MTC president. I was called in to the MTC President's office due to my attitude was not on par and he told me about a missionary that snuck out with a girl in his district and had sex on the Y stadium grass. He said my attitude was just like that elders.
Anyhow, I hated the MTC. It was the most miserable experience of my life. My mission on the other hand was much better.
| A new "Member Missionary Promise" is being instituted in some wards, requiring members to sign the following contract:
"MY PROMISE: I agree to pray morning and night to my Heavenly Father and ask Him to help me find someone who wants to listen to the missionary discussions. I will start praying on __________. I agree to be especially obedient to Heavenly Father's commandments during these 21 days. I will think about and do the things that will help me be more in tune with my Heavenly Father. I will read from the Book of Mormon every day. I will show love to everyone I meet, especially my family. I will think about Nephi. He had no idea how to get the brass plates fro Laban. The Lord directed him and showed him how. The Lord will show me how to find and prepare someone to take the missionary discussions. When the Lord prompts me to refer this person or family to the missionaries, I will heed this prompting. If possible, I will invite the person or family into my home to be taught the discussions and I will be a friend for them as they learn the gospel.
Member Missionary Name ______________________________________"
Blood oaths, signed contracts, new covenants, tithing settlements - the depths to which this "church" reaches into people's lives is amazing, treating them like mindless, spineless, automotons.
| Former Utah Gov. Olene Walker and her husband, Myron, have been named missionaries of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints to New York, where they are to work with U.N. diplomats.
"They want us to focus on making friends with some of the U.N. ambassadors where the church is having trouble with visas, or a country that does not allow the LDS missionaries to come in," she told KSL-TV on Wednesday.
The Walkers will enter the Missionary Training Center in Provo on May 30, and leave for New York City in June.
Walker, 74, was Utah's first women – and shortest-serving – governor. As lieutenant governor, she succeeded Mike Leavitt when he left the governor's post in November 2003 to head the Environmental Protection Agency. Leavitt is now Health and Human Services secretary.
Walker had consistently high job-approval ratings in polls – 87 percent at the time she left office – but state Republican delegates left her out of the 2004 primary race. Jon Huntsman was one of two Republicans who came out of the convention and he went on to win the primary and general elections.
Click Here For Original Link Or Thread.
| Its called "the commitment pattern". Its a high pressure sales technique developed by missionaries in Mexico, popular while I was on a mission in Minnesota.
The pattern revolves around making commitments with the investigator. There is always a commitment at the end of a discussion. Questions are phrased as "will you be baptised" and never "so what do you think about baptism? want to give it a whirl?"
Individuals who have a hard time saying no such as individuals who would be talking with the missionaries in the first place also have a hard time saying no to making commitments. They build a pattern of agreeing to do whatever the elders ask, no matter how silly it sounds such as dedicating ten percent of their income to a church they just are learning about.
Also, baptism is pushed as the goal very hard. Investigators are told that if they do not committ to the missionaries commitments that they will jeapordise their promise to be baptised, and what is worse than letting an authority figure down? Often the main tool of conversion is not the gospel message but a strong link between the missionaries and the "mark", AKA investigator. THe let down that the investigator percieves would occur has many dimensions and why it is so controlling is evidenced through the veracity of the missionaries need for a baptism.
The investigators I baptised in Minneapolis did so because they were lonely, in need of support or in some cases were so wrapped up in not letting me down that they didnt care wat the hell I asked them to do...they were going to be baptised and if they werent they thought I would be disappointed.
That is emotional control. No hypnosis, just guilt.
| Two very sweet missionaries live in my apartment complex. We met at the mail box one afternoon and hit it off.
These boys come to visit me 1-2 times a week. We sit out on the grass and talk (I'm single so they can't come in my house.) They love the Red Sox and Star Wars so we have lots to talk about. I always try to have something to feed them. I've bought them some star wars toys and we love to play with them and my toys from the 80s. I also let them help in my garden. They love that because they get to take off those dumb suits.
One day I asked them a question and they told me they would find out and "return and report." I couldn't stop laughing. Especially when the look of horror came over their faces when they realized what they had said. Then we acted out a scene "Deadly send down Jake and Matt to visit the bishop..." "Jake and Matt go down and visit the bishop"
They know I am an exmo and we have an understanding. They don't preach to me...I don't preach to them. (Actually I let them teach me a "lesson" so they can count the time we play as contact time.)
Well on Saturday they were supposed to come play with me when the ZL surprised them with a "24" which is this new evaluation procedure. Since seeing me was in their book they had to bring him over. I played along so I wouldn't get my friends in trouble.
The ZL bragged that he had heard every anti-argument ever. I got a little wicked gleam in my eye and was about to say something when I saw my friend frantically shaking his head and looking at me with pleading eyes. I quietly told the pompous ZL that I had read them all too. 'Tell me sister...does it make you feel good to read these things?" I couldn't resist and emphatic "YES!!" So then he bore his testimony to me.
I wanted to say more but I don't want my friends to get in trouble. I like them and feel that I can do them some good.
But WOW it felt GOOD to realize that yes....I feel good when I read the truth.
| For those who don't know the background, in 2002, Hinckley made this announcement in the priesthood session of General Conference:
""Now we have an interesting custom in the Church. Departing missionaries are accorded a farewell. In some wards this has become a problem. Between outgoing missionaries and returning missionaries, most sacrament meetings are devoted to farewells and homecomings."
So has this ban worked, or do some wards still let family members speak and do some families still have an open house? I left the church in 2001, so I haven't seen the effects of this ban on the church.
No one else in the Church has a farewell when entering a particular service. We never have a special farewell-type meeting for a newly called bishop, for a stake president, for a Relief Society president, for a General Authority, or anyone else of whom I can think. Why should we have missionary farewells?"
"The First Presidency and the Twelve, after most prayerful and careful consideration, have reached the decision that the present program of missionary farewells should be modified."
"The departing missionary will be given opportunity to speak in a sacrament meeting for 15 or 20 minutes. But parents and siblings will not be invited to do so. There might be two or more departing missionaries who speak in the same service. The meeting will be entirely in the hands of the bishop and will not be arranged by the family. There will not be special music or anything of that kind."
"We know this will be a great disappointment to many families. Mothers and fathers, brothers and sisters, and friends have participated in the past. We ask that you accept this decision. Where a farewell has already been arranged, it may go forward. But none in the traditional sense should be planned for the future. We are convinced that when all aspects of the situation are considered, this is a wise decision. Please accept it, my dear brethren. I extend this plea also to the sisters, particularly the mothers."
"We hope also that holding elaborate open houses after the sacrament meeting at which the missionary speaks will not prevail. Members of the family may wish to get together. We have no objection to this. However, we ask that there be no public reception to which large numbers are invited."
- The Prophet Gordon B. Hinckley, “To Men of the Priesthood,” Ensign, Nov. 2002, page 56
Have the members taken Hinckley seriously?
| My parent's are retired, and very, very TBM. They believe and obey everything, absolutely, 100%. If the COB decreed that they should sell everything they own, give 100% of everything over to TSCC, and move into a commune, they would do it. No questions asked. So as they've been retired I've watched the COB:
- Send them on 2 missions outside of their home
- Assign them to 2 missions while staying at their home
On one mission, they put over 50,000 miles on their own, personal, vehicle in one year. They were driving all over the damned country side, giving out free BoMs and Bibles. Couple missionaries are required to support themselves. So while on these missions they essentially had two homes to maintain. The house the mission provided them in one area was not provisioned with dishes and other necessary items, meaning they had to stock and purchase these items themselves. While on this mission my daughter had a major surgery. My mother called me, crying on the phone, because she wanted to be there with my daughter. They were very close, and my mother ALWAYS wants to be involved with her children and grandchildren. I told her that we would be ok, and I called her a couple of times a day. We were doing ok. Sure, I missed her. Mission rules stated that she could not come home to visit, for any reason. My mother was suffering over this. One of my siblings told her to just hop on a plane. What would the COB do about it anyway? There was no way my obedient TBM mother would even consider such a thing. So there she stayed, worrying over my DD and desparately wishing she was at the hospital.
A mission that was local to their home required that they feed an office of volunteers, using their own funds. So everyday they made lunch for a dozen or so people, they did this for a year.
A mission that is ongoing, and hasn't stopped for over a decade is hours and hours of typing genealogy information into a computer. I would estimate that they spend about 2 hours a day on this.
And lastly, I guess somewhere recently an arrogant, self serving, money-grubbing church someone or other declared that parents should not leave their inheritance to their children. It was declared that their children should be able to take care of themselves. And if they couldn't, well too bad! That'll learn 'em! And that the church needed their inheritance more than their children did. hmmmph. On a personal level, yes, I can take care of myself. I have siblings who are struggling, and could use help more than the COB needs more money. But what bugs me the most on this is the absolute utter balls with no shame. They have milked my parents over and over and over their entire lives, and even into their retirement years, and they want to continue doing so even after they are dead! It is appalling! Scam artists do less and spend years in prison!
To me all of these things that the COB encourages, asks and requires of old folks to do is unethical beyond belief. They are a multi-billion dollar organization that is very aware of the influence they have over people's very thoughts and actions. An influence that they constantly cultivate, nurture, and enforce correction when the influence is questioned. I'm no longer prescribe to any religion, or belief system. I do remember from my church going days what was taught as Christ like. And taking advantage of people, especially old folks, ain't it! It is the behavior of a CULT.
| For Mormons, the devil is a fallen angel. He rebelled against God and Christ in a pre-Earth life and persuaded one third of the other spirits in heaven to join with him. As fallen angels, they didn't get bodies. Now they want desperately to have one, so they try every way they can to jump into someone else's skin.
Sometimes these spirits have to be cast out of "afflicted persons by the power of faith and authority of the priesthood," wrote Bruce R. McConkie in his authoritative book, Mormon Doctrine.
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints believes that missionaries are particularly vulnerable. Thus, the army of men and women serving the church on two-year and 1 1/2 -year missions are forbidden to swim, which some LDS members attribute to the belief that Satan controls the water.
But LDS Church spokesman Scott Trotter put it in more practical terms.
"The church takes any necessary precautions to ensure the safety of its missionaries from natural disaster, public health threats or other potentially harmful situations," says Trotter.
Click Here For Original Link Or Thread.
| In addition to "raising the bar" on Elder missionaries, the church has also discouraged women from serviing missions. |
In the fall 1997 Priesthood Session of conference (instead of the Women's conference), Hinckley announced this church
"There seems to be growing in the Church an idea that all young women as well as all young men should go on
missions. We need some young women. They perform a remarkable work. They can get in homes where the elders cannot."
"I wish to say that the First Presidency and the Council of the Twelve are united in saying to our young sisters that
they are not under obligation to go on missions. I hope I can say what I have to say in a way that will not be offensive to
anyone. Young women should not feel that they have a duty comparable to that of young men. Some of them will very much wish to
go. If so, they should counsel with their bishop as well as their parents. If the idea persists, the bishop will know what to
"I say what has been said before, that missionary work is essentially a priesthood responsibility. As such, our
young men must carry the major burden. This is their responsibility and their obligation."
"We do not ask the young
women to consider a mission as an essential part of their life’s program. Over a period of many years, we have held the age level
higher for them in an effort to keep the number going relatively small. Again to the sisters I say that you will be as highly
respected, you will be considered as being as much in the line of duty, your efforts will be as acceptable to the Lord and to the
Church whether you go on a mission or do not go on a mission."
"We constantly receive letters from young women asking
why the age for sister missionaries is not the same as it is for elders. We simply give them the reasons. We know that they are
disappointed. We know that many have set their hearts on missions. We know that many of them wish this experience before they
marry and go forward with their adult lives. I certainly do not wish to say or imply that their services are not wanted. I
simply say that a mission is not necessary as a part of their lives."
"Now, that may appear to be something of a
strange thing to say in priesthood meeting. I say it here because I do not know where else to say it. The bishops and
stake presidents of the Church have now heard it. And they must be the ones who make the judgment in this matter."
"That is enough on that subject."
- Gordon B. Hinckley, “Some Thoughts on Temples, Retention of Converts, and
Missionary Service,” Ensign, Nov. 1997, 49
Hinckley's statement is demeaning on several levels, but the point is,
the church has intentionally discouraged both young men AND young women from serving. What do you think is going on here?
| We were actually taught to discourage members from reading the whole BoM before baptism. I mean, if they really wanted to read it, great, as long as it didn't postpone thier baptism date. But if the investigators felt like they needed to take things more slowly, and really read the whole book before they made a decision, that was considered a "concern" that needed to be resolved.
We used the cake dialogue. If you eat one piece of cake, and it's good, then isn't it a safe assumption that the rest of the cake is good, too? You don't need to eat the whole cake, just a piece, or even a bite. Same with the BoM. If 3 Nephi 11 is good, then the whole book must be good. And by good, we mean true. So don't worry about reading the whole thing. Just get baptized.
Of course, by this logic, every movie would be as good as its trailer. But it's part of the mormon marketing tactic that tries to find one thing that you like about the Church, then load everything else on top of that. If 3 Ne 11 is true, then the whole BoM must be true, which means JS must be a prophet, which means the Church must be true, which means GBH must be a prophet, etc. In actuality, none of those things necessarily follows from the other.
| Just when I've thought there is nothing more that mishies can do to prove they are brain dead, immature, idiotic, culturally insensitive dolts, I find this (click here):
From the Venezuela Maracaibo mission, the gem is titled "Finding the Chosen", and shows a North American missionary pretending to preach to a shoeless man who has obviously seen hard times; the man is asleep under a tree. What the hell, I'll post it here.
"Ok ok, so we got off to a rough start... Nate T. Nelson 03 Sep 2005
Editor Note: As of 10:43 AM MST the entire article was pulled off the site: http://www.mission.net/venezuela/mara...
If you enhance the picture, you'll see a couple of plastic bags next to the tree that are probably all the man owns--that, or the trash the neighbors set out. (note: on second thought, they're probably trash).
Ha ha ha...and you wonder why the Chavistas want to kick their asses."
| My step son is leaving on a mission in a couple weeks. Although I went on a mission, I forgot how many little things are changed by going on a mission. I'm not talking about putting college on hold, or quitting a job, I am thinking of the seemingly insignificant things.
My step son is a good kid. He is quiet. He hasn't ever drank. He is an A student. He has had a steady girlfriend, he says they aren't physical, except for holding hands and hugs (it seems to be true from being around them for two years). He wears baseball caps and T-shirts. He has a goatee. He likes rock music, Pepsi, and pizza. He loves Xbox and golf.
My TBM wife took him shopping last week. They bought two suits and about 12 white shirts. He got two pair of Doc Martens. He bought several ties. Yesterday he bought a bunch of temple garments, preparing for the temple next week. He says he is nervous to go, but he says he really wants to go, and is excited.
I have never heard him talk about the church. I have never seen him read scriptures. He says family prayer, goes to church, and goes hometeaching. He is going on a mission because it has been expected of him for all his life. In two weeks his life will be completely different.
He will wear white shirts everyday. He will carry scriptures with him wherever he goes. He will shave his goatee, and cut his hair. He will rise early each morning and study scriptures, he will talk about the church to strangers all day. He won't see or talk to his girlfriend, family, or friends. He will be in a strange place doing strange things.
His TBM family is elated and proud of him. He is doing what is expected of him. So why do I feel like he is having a lobotomy? I see the life and personality being sucked out of him. He'll be doing things against his natural personality, learning how to cross people's personal boundaries, how to talk about religion with non interested persons, and how to make people believe like he does.
It's not fair. The church puts so much guilt on these kids. The kids try to make themselves believe god is calling them. He feels he is doing what god wants.
How did the church get so much influence in his life? How can a healthy 19 year old give away two years to a dishonest, deceitful church?
It makes me sick to see him give up so much for a big lie. I want to take him aside and tell him everything. I would then be treated like a possessed devil, so I sit silently and ache for him. Can't we do something?
| Elders Scott Clarke and Ethan Farmer represent a significant change in how the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints runs its mission program.
For the first time ever, the number of missionaries has declined. There were 61,638 missionaries serving worldwide in 2002. In 2004, there were fewer than 52,000.
This decline comes despite continuing growth of the church and is the result of a "raising of the bar" for missionaries.
The LDS Church has decided to move away from the days when young people went on a mission because they felt they were supposed to. Now the church wants people to serve because their faith is so strong they feel they must.
The mission remains the same. It is hard work, there are many sacrifices and missionaries end up talking to strangers about things those potential converts may not want to talk about.
But now, if a young man is not ready at age 19 to start his mission, he will be advised to wait.
| Census results from several countries show a self-identification rate of around 22%; I'd bet that the activity rates in those countries is even lower, somewhere on the order of 8-13%.
My guess, based on what I've seen over the years, is that most of those who are active are part of extended family groups of Mormons, or they are close friends with multiple members of those family groups. Were it possible to break the activity stats down further, we'd likely find a majority of those who claim to be LDS are the children of LDS people--in other words, they were never converts in the sense of being found and taught by missionaries.
Out of those we could consider classic converts, if 10% remain active I'd be very suprised. I'll even go out on a limb and say the retention rate is likely less than 1% for those who are baptized with no family or close friendship connection to the Church.
Another key to activity is the socio-economic strata they belong to. David Knowlton sliced and diced the Chilean and Mexican census results in the Summer 2005 Dialogue, and one of the interesting things he found is that the areas with the greatest numbers of self-identifying Mormons were lower to lower middle class suburbs of the major cities, places inhabited mainly by what we'd call the working poor.
Areas that were upper-middle to upper class followed, with lower class/slum areas having the least numbers of people claiming to be Mormons in them. It would be fascinating for geeks like me to overlay those figures with official figures showing where their baptisms have come from. I'd bet most of the baptisms have come from the areas with the lowest percentage of self-IDing Mormons.
At this stage, I'm actually more interested in the effect that being in one of these missions--like Chile in its heyday--will have on individual missionaries that served there.
In other words, will the knowledge that what should have been sacred ordinances were instead treated as sales goals eventually cause cognitive dissonance in the salesmen?
Or will it instead lead to more guilt, something along the lines of "if I'd had more faith, these people would have stayed active"?
Will any of them begin to question the entire program and decide that it isn't worth risking their kids health and welfare?
Shit who am I kidding? They'll probably blame the few actives for not retaining their converts and tell themselves getting dysentery will help young Lance become a man.
As sort of a "the more things change, the more they stay the same", on a Chilean mission website a recently returned missionary reports they are baptizing between 900 and 1200 people a month. Looks like Holland's clean up campaign lasted little more than he did.
| Imagine asking someone to spend 15 hours per day (6 hours on Preparation Day) working for you for 2 years, make THEM provide for their own room and board, and then ignore them once they're done like they didn't even exist. |
This is MormonDumb...or...the people who do it are LDSDumb!
When we got back from our missions we didn't get a nickel off of tuition at "The Lord's School". We didn't have a group of employment specialists pulling strings across Utah to make sure that we got jobs to support ourselves and our pregnant wives while we went to school. We didn't even get a "hold off on that tithing until your education is done" offer.
Nope. Nada. Nichts.
And as I was browsing around the LDS.ORGasm website, I noticed that under the Serving the church link there is not so much as a "Thank-you" to missionaries and their families for recruiting new tithepayers. They've got a "Military Relations" link, but nothing for the missionaries.
Nope. Nada. Nichts.
Hidden on the Site Map is a link to Church-Service Missionary Opportunities but still does not praise the amazing sacrifice of young men and women who should be screwing and having a good time instead of suffering the mental abuse of celibacy and failure to convert reasonable people.
When you do find an LDS Missonary website, LDS Missions Website, the links to many missions are old and outdated. It's not even run by the crutch! Sheesh!
Why would not the church pay someone to maintain these websites, at least out of respect for the millions of hours offered by its missionaries? Why? Why not just host the goddamned things?
It's because the Mormon Church is an abusive organization that cares very little about its members. Service is exploited. Few are really respected, the specious claims of the church notwithstanding.
| Last night we had the missionaries over for dinner. It was an interesting conversation.
They told me the same story about how they were told they were not to eat at members' houses without a nonmember or investigator there (apparently, that may have been rescinded). I asked him when they were supposed to eat, and he said, "I don't really know." He and I agreed that having a nonmember at every meal was impossible. He said, "I don't know how inspired that counsel was." I said, "I have an idea."
Then we got talking about the new, "inspired" Preach My Gospel program. Jokingly I said that the old program must not have been inspired. The elder got really serious and said, "The new program is inspired for our time. The old program was what the people were ready for then." I told him that the church should lighten up, that it's OK to admit that the old program wasn't working and that they needed to change it. He looked at me like I had just punched him in the stomach.
It was kind of like going back in time and seeing the kinds of attitudes I had on my mission. Unquestioning obedience and acceptance, even in the face of unreasonable demands. And childlike faith in the love and good intentions of their leaders.
By the way, does anyone know where this crap about eating with nonmembers comes from? It seems to be a widespread mandate, which suggests that it came from above the mission presidents' heads.
| Reading other pro-LDS message boards, and recalling my forty plus years as a True Believing Mormon, it became clear to me that the most important strategies employed by the church are Ignorance and Misinformation. |
This two-pronged approach first uses the principle of IGNORANCE to hide from uninformed, inquiring minds anything that might be unpleasant about the church. It keeps people ignorant of facts that might make them expect a reasonable explanation. An example of this is sanitizing the problem of polygamy from the church museums. My recent visits to the Beehive House, Mormon History Museum and Temple Square Visitor Centers are glaring examples of this practice. No unsolicited mention of polygamy exists in any of these locations.
The second principle in this scheme uses MISINFORMATION when someone, despite the obvious attempts of the Church's PR department to rewrite history by excluding polygamy, raises polygamy in the museums and visitor centers. They are immediately told how only a very small percentage of Mormons practiced it, without explaining why that is relevant; they indicate that it was to care for the overabundance of women, without providing proof that there was, in actual fact, the alleged overabundance; they explain that "god made us do it" when challenged to explain the connection polygamy had with a religious organization; and they distance themselves from the current practice of polygamy by declaring that it is not condoned by the church, anyone practicing it is excommunicated, and by denying that the church practiced it privately long after it had declared publicly that it was no longer practicing it. By perpetuating urban legends about these practices they use MISINFORMATION to inoculate seekers from the truth.
What helps these strategies is the obvious ignorance of the 20-something missionaries who are being manipulated by the older shepherds.
In the Beehive House there was an array of six or eight sister missionaries being watched over by a very business-like father-figure. I was absolutely certain that if I had started questioning the polygamy in the foyer within earshot of him that he would have accompanied us on the tour. He looked like he'd been pitted against anti-mormons making their way through this holy mecca before and was very keen to the clues that would get him engaged to protect these young women from ...... QUESTIONS.
When I got them away from him, though, their testimonies of the hidden mysteries of the Church were weak. They confessed that THEY would not like to practice polygamy and share a husband.
"REALLY?" I asked. "But isn't this a commandment?"
andlt;Nervous laughter.andgt; "Not anymore."
| From Deseret News:
"Tyler Poulson, 21, was killed Friday night after getting out of a moving pickup truck that was traveling about 35 mph near 10900 South and 1300 West."
Apparently he was not happy about his brother swearing:
"Poulson, who felt offended, eventually said he would get out of the truck if it continued. Considering it an empty threat, one of the men told him to do it"
| First discussion:
- Multiple accounts of the first vision
- Discussion of no report of the first vision until long after it occurred
- Joseph Smith’s money digging trial
- View of the Hebrews
- Changes to the Book of Mormon
- Bad grammar in the first edition
- DNA, archaeological, anthropological, geographical, and linguistic evidence that disproves the Book of Mormon
- Joseph Smith’s banking fraud
- The Kinderhook plates fraud
- Book of Abraham fraud
- New Testament written long after the events by people who never knew Jesus
- Historical doubts about the existence of Jesus
- Borrowed myths that have been incorporated into the Jesus myth
- Discussion of evolution and how Genesis consists of borrowed myths
- Discussion of the borrowed myths and outright lies in the Old Testament
- Joseph Smith’s and Brigham Young’s polygamous marriages including sending husbands on missions in order to marry their wives, and marriages to pregnant wives of other men
- Joseph Smith’s affair with Fanny Alger and creating the concept of polygamy after being caught in other adulterous relationships
- The commandment from modern day prophets to marry before graduating from college and having as many children as possible
- High levels of depression, suicide, and bankruptcy in the Mormon Church
- Expectation to serve a mission at own expense
- Show a video that containing all of the temple ceremonies from beginning to end including the now missing blood oaths and initiatories covering by a small sheet
- Full comparison of Mormon temple cult ceremony to the Masonic cult ceremony
- Explanation of Joseph Smith’s “revelation” concerning the temple ceremonies just weeks after being exposed to the Masonic cult ceremony including absolute lack of temple cult ceremony in the Kirtland temple
- Discussion of tithing and how often this commandment leads to bankruptcy
- Disclosure of the church’s financial statements
- Mountain Meadows Massacre and Brigham Young framing his adopted son, John Lee, for the murders
- The Hoffman scandal and Hinckley’s role in the cover up
- Hinckley’s duplicity on common Mormon doctrine
- Disclosure concerning purchasing malls, ranches, etc.
- Discussion of the Word of Wisdom and how it is incorrect in some respects based on modern medical science
Additionally, these factors should be the only material allowed to be taught in Sacrament Meeting, Primary, Sunday School, Priesthood, Relief Society, Conference talks, firesides, Institute, religion classes at BYU, Seminary, and in ALL church approved publications.
- Invitation to be baptized
How to navigate:
- Click the subject below to go directly to the article.
- Click the blue arrow on the article to return to the top.
- Right-Click and copy the "-Guid-" (the Link Location URL) for a direct link to the page and article.
|Articles posted here are © by their respective owners when designated. |
Website © 2005-2021
Compiled With: Caligra 1.119